Drawar

Why not - if sawn up animals, beds, urinals and piles of bricks get shown in galleries, this is as valid as that (even if I think it's crap - which I do).

Not it shouldn't because it required no craft to make it. Damien Hirst is never a good yard stick of artistic ability!!

;o)

I'm with publicenergy. At a recent visit to the Tate Modern, I saw 120 perfectly laid out bricks on the floor. If they can get that, and a toilet, and a video of a guy jumping up and down, repeatedly saying "no!" in, I don't see why not a spike full of spam.

Mound of butter remains one of my favorite paintings. It sits in the National Gallery of Art

If she painted the pile of junk mail then it would be art, not very interesting art but it would be art.

It's art even without her painting it, but the best way for her to get it into a Gallery would be to make a name for herself doing artwork with similar ideas, or visually similar pieces, etc. etc. I think it's an neat idea to use junk mail as art, supposedly making is more useful in some way, but just putting it on a spike seems less inspired to me.

To me it is not art. She just stuck pieces of junk mail on a stick. She had no specific plans on the outcome of the "work" - to me that is what makes something art.

If she had done something with the junk mail, like make it into a dog like this person did with newspaper, it would be something to admire and appreciated. The only thing stopping a 2 yr old from doing the same thing is the height of the pole to stick the junk mail on.

Nah, I don't think it's art. As Tyme said, all she's done is slapped some junk mail on a spike. That's not artistic, it's just putting junk mail on a stick.

I should, however, state that I'm pretty harsh on what I define as art. For example, I think Jackson Pollock's work is.. well, junk. He threw, splattered, etc. paint all over a canvas. Big deal. That doesn't take any skill. And yet someone in Ze Art World deemed it amazing, and now his stuff is worth millions. I'm okay with abstract art as long as producing the abstract art takes some kind of skill or expertise, but throwing paint? No.

why is all the text after my entry underlined? What did I do?

@Article19: I'm not seeing anything underlined. Are you still seeing it underlined?

Just checked in Camino and it doesn't do it, only in Safari 3.0. It's a live link to the butter image.

Very odd!

Ok fixed it. The link on the image wasn't closed properly. :) Thanks!

Something can be art and require absolutely no skill. In this case its more about the statement than skill. And in this case, and many others, there is no skill required.

It almost begs for a different label than art. Maybe something like "Materials Based Social Commentary"

It almost begs for a different label than art. Maybe something like "Materials Based Social Commentary"

I actually like that idea. Certainly, I see that what she's doing has some value - it is an interesting message, I admit that. I just have a really hard time calling it "art." I mean, do we really see a spike with junk mail on it on the same level as say, The Birth of Adam in the Sistine Chapel, or Starry Night by van Gogh?

Social comentary, sure. Art? I'm not buying it.

IMHO, a work of art is rendered through communication between the artist and the viewer, describing an experience or commentary, either directly or indirectly related to the human condition. This is just trash on a stick.

This is called attention seeking.

This is called attention seeking.

Hah! Best reply in this thread so far.

Tyme:

"she had no specific plans on the outcome of the "work" - to me that is what makes something art."

What if her 'specific plans' were to put junk mail on a stick? Just because it's not impressive or insanely creative doesn't mean it isn't planned or specific.

Palmettoart:

IMHO, a work of art is rendered through communication between the artist and the viewer, describing an experience or commentary, either directly or indirectly related to the human condition. This is just trash on a stick.

Ruling out that junkmail on a stick doesn't communicate between the artist and the viewer is probably not a good idea, as I'm sure it communicates to quite a lot of people who'd love to be rid of their junk mail. OR at the very least, it probably annoys people who walk by and have to see it, which is definitely a form of communication!

Cappucino has hit on the core of all of these "is it art" discussions, is that everything depends on your personal definition of the word 'Art'. Although Capp did say that it requires no skill to put junkmail on a stick, I'd say think about the differences between a person doing this act and a dog attempting to do the same thing and then realise the amount of manual dexterity we take for granted, etc. etc. etc. art BS art BS and all that jazz...

At least everyone here is smart enough to know that -someone- probably considers this art, not matter what the hell it is. Oh and yea I agree, this was probably very much influenced by seeking attention.

@Bartoneus:

Cappucino has hit on the core of all of these "is it art" discussions, is that everything depends on your personal definition of the word 'Art'.

Very true, that. I lean more towards the more classic arts, personally. I don't really see a lot of new art / "modern art" as art. Certainly, a lot of the stuff is interesting, but I'm still hesitant to buy into the label of art.

One of the things (or "pieces" in art speak, heh) that we looked at in an art class I'm in is some rows of boulders. Just rocks. The artist lined them up next to a church, on a lawn between the church and the sidewalk. The rows of boulders were progressively shorter, i.e. a row of 6, a row of 5, etc.

People didn't get it. After a lot of grumbling, a local paper interviewed the guy, and he explained it. He was - what was it again? - juxtaposing the timelessness of the rocks with the aging church and its graveyard. Or something to that effect, anyway, just much longer and complicated-sounding. To me, it sounded like a bunch of.. well, art BS. :P

I think calling a simple mechanical process, putting paper on a spike, art is something that's watering down the whole idea of creative skill and ability.

Even small children painting on the kitchen table are exhibiting complex, creative ability which far exceeds this lady's creative talents with regard to this particular, for want of a better word, thing!

Sorry my butter painting was stealing your links. I forget the closing / sometimes.

Art is such a hard topic to discuss. Anything could be considered art and I've always thought art is art if someone displays it as such.

The question is, will anyone display it?

Looks like she's displaying it right in her front yard?

Art forms (no matter what form it takes) makes a statement, and this certainly is making a statement on junk mail. I see where she is going with this, in that respect.

I wouldn't go to an art gallery to see it, though.

I think it'd be defined as art in the total modern sense. Modern art is accessible art, etc. Like Warhol's Campbell's Soup. Flavin's flourescent lights. But that's just the definition. Whether or not it's "good" art is of course in the hands of the viewer. I certainly wouldn't go see it--I get pieces of that everyday that I throw away all the time so I certainly don't need to go to a museum to see a huge pile of it.

@Rich, your flickr pics bring back memories as I was at the Tate viewing that VW van and pile of bricks exactly a month ago. :)

Art, like beauty, is in the eye of the beholder. Whether one views a pile of junk mail on a stick as art or not, doesn't make it so. In my eyes, it;s not. However, some eccentric millionaire will purchase this and the "artist" will make millions.
I found this site because I'm writing a paper on whether modern art is junk or not. I love Impressionist and always will.

What if someone were to do a painting of said spike o' junk mail? Would that, then, not be art also as it is just a spike of junk mail? Or a picture of the pile of junk mail?

Is someone truly more of an artist for taking a picture of the pile of junk mail than the person who created it?

The "tell" is -- She has hopes that once it's complete it will be displayed in an art gallery. Would she leave it on her own lawn for very long? I doubt it.

Sounds like she's trying to buy a ticket on the gravy train.

I think this is "art" as an afterthought. It probably started as a statement against waste. Something about art is that there generally has to be intention - this is just a case of someone making a statement about junk mail, which got noticed by the paper. How she thinks this will pass as art is beyond me. If some eccentric art collector buys it off her for millions, good for her. Unfortunately, bad for the art community.

@Giant: I love your avatar, it's a piece of art! ;)